Cultic Studies Journal, Vol. 6, No. 2, 1989, Page 42
of eclipses, and how the Krishnas try to explain this in view of their belief that the sun is
closer to the earth than the moon. Ken had great difficulty understanding this, so Sandy had
him use his fist to block the light from a light bulb in order to demonstrate the principle of
eclipses. They discussed Krishna belief that the moon generates its own light, as opposed to
reflecting the sun. I was surprised when Ken defended this strange belief. “Some people
believe that (the sun is closer].” Sandy seemed less unsettled, and he responded with a
question. “Yeah, but does that [belief] make it real?” “As real as the Christian concept of
heaven and hell,” Ken answered, continuing his defense. Sandy ignored this counterattack,
and returned to his argument that the moon, contrary to Krishna belief, is not inhabited.
Sandy: “This is different, there is lots of proof. Men have walked on the moon.” Ken cited
Krishna doctrine: the lunar landing was a hoax. filmed in the Arizona desert. Now Sandy's
voice grew loud. He lives in the Arizona desert and it does not at all resemble the moon’s
surface. He also noted that the U.S. was not the only country with a space program--proof
of space travel is continuously confirmed by other countries, too. In fact, Sandy then stated,
other nations have a space program. Ken spontaneously added “Including [Hindu] India!”
Sandy grew excited by Ken's contributions “Right! Including India! They sent up some ...
communications satellites ...they sent up an astronaut, with the Russians.” But then, as
fast as he had contributed to Sandy's attack, Ken backtracked: the Indian space program
might still be a hoax, he quickly added. After all, Indian gurus had not confirmed the Indian
space program. Rather, the Indian space program might be an illusion concocted by Indian
politicians, who while claiming to be Hindu, are just as corrupt as Western politicians. Sandy
responded softly, but with vehemence. Truth in a court of law is established by admitting
evidence. Now, Ken seemed to have an answer to all of Sandy's criticisms, and he reminded
Sandy that courts of law can be subject to jury tampering. Sandy did not retreat. Instead,
he reminded Ken that there are scores if not hundreds, of companies, organizations, and
agencies that are out to fight and disprove what official government information says.
“Somebody's gonna find out if it‟s a hoax,” he insisted.
Impressions. My own impression was that Ken may have regressed somewhat overnight
He seemed a bit distant. Of Course, he had not gotten much sleep, and it seemed clear to
me (and perhaps to Ken as well) that Curt and Greg were the “primary” deprogrammers,
while Sandy was “secondary. Ken and Sandy also seemed to have more trouble relating to
each other, or so it seemed to me. This impression was later confirmed in my analysis of
conversational styles. Their backgrounds were so different. Finally, Ken did not seem to be
responding directly to other people's personal experiences. He usually reacted judgmentally,
and he seemed incapable or unwilling to take on their perspective. On the other hand, he
did relate indirectly to the experiences of others. He seemed occasionally to use other
personal experiences as a starting point for expressing (and possibly reevaluating) his own
experiences that is, when told a story, he often responded with a story of his own. So there
was some communication. Still, in general he argued a lot, and he often seemed to be
making few solid connections. If he could see corruption in one temple, for example, he
could not express how that corruption in that temple might be a symptom of a larger
“disease.” It was as though that information did not generalize. It did not, to use a
cybernetic and holographic metaphor, influence any other “circuits.” Ken was occasionally
expressing his own doubts, however, and every now and then he seemed to have a
spontaneous burst of deductive reasoning. When Sandy or Curt interpreted these doubts as
Ken's rational side rather than his demonic side, Ken verbally accepted this interpretation
while on a deeper level he balked. He just seemed not to process what was being said.
Ken's own doubts seemed compartmentalized and unintegrated, although he seemed to feel
positively about expressing them.
There were times when Ken seemed to be parroting, almost parodying, the standard
Krishna line, as though he were doing his duty but could somehow see how absurd the lines
were. At these times, he would make a Krishna statement but would chuckle. Perhaps by
of eclipses, and how the Krishnas try to explain this in view of their belief that the sun is
closer to the earth than the moon. Ken had great difficulty understanding this, so Sandy had
him use his fist to block the light from a light bulb in order to demonstrate the principle of
eclipses. They discussed Krishna belief that the moon generates its own light, as opposed to
reflecting the sun. I was surprised when Ken defended this strange belief. “Some people
believe that (the sun is closer].” Sandy seemed less unsettled, and he responded with a
question. “Yeah, but does that [belief] make it real?” “As real as the Christian concept of
heaven and hell,” Ken answered, continuing his defense. Sandy ignored this counterattack,
and returned to his argument that the moon, contrary to Krishna belief, is not inhabited.
Sandy: “This is different, there is lots of proof. Men have walked on the moon.” Ken cited
Krishna doctrine: the lunar landing was a hoax. filmed in the Arizona desert. Now Sandy's
voice grew loud. He lives in the Arizona desert and it does not at all resemble the moon’s
surface. He also noted that the U.S. was not the only country with a space program--proof
of space travel is continuously confirmed by other countries, too. In fact, Sandy then stated,
other nations have a space program. Ken spontaneously added “Including [Hindu] India!”
Sandy grew excited by Ken's contributions “Right! Including India! They sent up some ...
communications satellites ...they sent up an astronaut, with the Russians.” But then, as
fast as he had contributed to Sandy's attack, Ken backtracked: the Indian space program
might still be a hoax, he quickly added. After all, Indian gurus had not confirmed the Indian
space program. Rather, the Indian space program might be an illusion concocted by Indian
politicians, who while claiming to be Hindu, are just as corrupt as Western politicians. Sandy
responded softly, but with vehemence. Truth in a court of law is established by admitting
evidence. Now, Ken seemed to have an answer to all of Sandy's criticisms, and he reminded
Sandy that courts of law can be subject to jury tampering. Sandy did not retreat. Instead,
he reminded Ken that there are scores if not hundreds, of companies, organizations, and
agencies that are out to fight and disprove what official government information says.
“Somebody's gonna find out if it‟s a hoax,” he insisted.
Impressions. My own impression was that Ken may have regressed somewhat overnight
He seemed a bit distant. Of Course, he had not gotten much sleep, and it seemed clear to
me (and perhaps to Ken as well) that Curt and Greg were the “primary” deprogrammers,
while Sandy was “secondary. Ken and Sandy also seemed to have more trouble relating to
each other, or so it seemed to me. This impression was later confirmed in my analysis of
conversational styles. Their backgrounds were so different. Finally, Ken did not seem to be
responding directly to other people's personal experiences. He usually reacted judgmentally,
and he seemed incapable or unwilling to take on their perspective. On the other hand, he
did relate indirectly to the experiences of others. He seemed occasionally to use other
personal experiences as a starting point for expressing (and possibly reevaluating) his own
experiences that is, when told a story, he often responded with a story of his own. So there
was some communication. Still, in general he argued a lot, and he often seemed to be
making few solid connections. If he could see corruption in one temple, for example, he
could not express how that corruption in that temple might be a symptom of a larger
“disease.” It was as though that information did not generalize. It did not, to use a
cybernetic and holographic metaphor, influence any other “circuits.” Ken was occasionally
expressing his own doubts, however, and every now and then he seemed to have a
spontaneous burst of deductive reasoning. When Sandy or Curt interpreted these doubts as
Ken's rational side rather than his demonic side, Ken verbally accepted this interpretation
while on a deeper level he balked. He just seemed not to process what was being said.
Ken's own doubts seemed compartmentalized and unintegrated, although he seemed to feel
positively about expressing them.
There were times when Ken seemed to be parroting, almost parodying, the standard
Krishna line, as though he were doing his duty but could somehow see how absurd the lines
were. At these times, he would make a Krishna statement but would chuckle. Perhaps by
